[Proposal][Infernalism genre Packet] and [Bylaw Amendments amended] [Objection]

Open Votes

Proposal Type: Bylaw Revision
Opened: 20-Aug-2018 12:00AM EDT
Closing: 27-Aug-2018 12:00AM EDT


I Robert S as Demon Coordinator in relation to performing the tasks of this genre coordinator position here by propose the following, Genre packet and following bylaw amendments. 
 
Below after the list of bylaw amendments, additions and subtractions to demon genre items; a link will be found to the new infernalism packet that we are in the process of translating for our Brazil gaming community.  
 
Due to the major changes, we are asking to do a special form of grandfathering for those player thralls and diabolists characters this impacts. We would like to ask for a 90 day special grandfathering. Because of this we will not be propping this to auto approve. This  extended  grandfathering process will allow all player characters this impacts can renew their BA and do one of the following. 
 
1) Convert to the new system. 
2) Give notice requesting to stay as is, but be frozen from gaining future investments
 
Any character that fails to do either within 90 days will be out of compliance 
 
As stated before per the R&U database this will mainly impact two player characters. NPCs are being excluded from this process of opting in for conversion as one controlled by coords will be amended as they enter play if needed, and currently all but 3 chronicle/other offices controlled infernals will be mostly unaffected by this process, per R&U database data. 
 
Packet highlights. 
1: Genre views and common access points for dealing with the infernal. 
2: Update to summoning and demon creature types
3: New Bargains, Deals, and Pact system. from Rites of the blood. 
4: Giving the Kj office authority to handle Yama king pacts as they should. 
5: System updates to the life of a Thrall
6: Mechanic and system updates to Diabolism
7: New system for determining soul Value
8: Infernal corruption is back
9: Stream lined investment packet: Everything that mimicked power, ritual or merit was removed and put into a catch all investment for each catacory. 
10: A few investments are added as they are in the fluff but not the printed mechanics. 
11: Rarity system majorly adjusted for better tracking of PC infernals, while freeing up npc infernals greatly for st use.
12: New Backgrounds added to reflect current bylaws. 
13: Infernal rank majorly scaled back on investment options, and adjusted to reflect RP and advancement for thralls and Diabolists in power structures of hell. 
14: Very rough outline for fallen lore levels. 
15: New infernal merit and materials added to mimick baali packet. Key demonic merits clarified if attached flaws count towards character gen. They do not. 
16: Flaw list greatly expanded to help with infernal character creation. 
17: Infernal combis cleaned up per council and st input. 
18: Detection mechanics added per rites of the blood and many of the different genre detection mechanics, as provided by the different coord teams; along with a few custom ones. There is also a few created by this office to help give guide lines and ideas for chronicles wishing to follow. 
 
Bylaw changes and amendments of amendments. 
 
From 
  1. Custom Content
    1. Defined as any sort of power, item or similar listings which has not been printed in a White Wolf/Onyx Path/CCP book.
    2. Creating Custom Content (Notification items apply to Vampire Players and their playable characters (PCs) only. Items designated as Coordinator (coord) Approval apply to both PCs and NPCs)
      1. Blood Magic, including both Paths and Rituals, requires the previous approval of the appropriate Coordinator for the Blood Magic in accordance with Coordinator Bylaws (Section 3.C.ii.6.a)
      2. Disciplines, Combination Disciplines and Discipline Techniques requires Notification to the Coordinator responsible for the Clan/Discipline of the character creating the custom content unless otherwise specified below:
        1. Combination Disciplines and/or Techniques which require a component of either Blood Magic or a clan-specific Discipline also requires Notification to the Coordinator responsible for the Blood Magic paradigm or clan-specific Discipline.
        2. Caitiff and Panders are overseen by the appropriate Sect Coordinator
        3. Custom Combination Discipline or Technique using Protean, Abombwe, Spiritus, and/or Ogham requires Gangrel Coordinator Approval
        4. Custom Combination Discipline or Technique using Chimerstry requires Ravnos Coordinator Approval
        5. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique or other custom content using Temporis requires Brujah Coordinator Approval
        6. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique or other custom content using Dementation requires Malkavian Coordinator Approval for Non-Malkavians
        7. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique, or other custom content using Flight and/or Visceratika requires Tremere Coordinator Approval
        8. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique or other custom content using Quietus requires Assamite Coordinator Approval
  2. DEMON CONTROLLED ITEMS< >Abilities and Lores< >Baali Lore each level - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Baali lore 1-3 For Baali, Baali Apostates, and Angellis blood line - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Baali lore 1-2 Tzimisce Clan advantage in Laws of the Night, Jocastians, Loyalist Assamites, Occult Underground lore masters, Sabbat Inquisition, Josians, and Clan Nosferatu lore masters - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Fallen Lore 1-5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Demonology level 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Demonology level 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernal Lore level 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernal Lore level 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Plague Breeding level 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Plague Breeding level 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Creature Types< >Demon Rank 5 or Less - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Rank 6+ Demon - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Earthbound Demon - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Baali - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Including Baali Apostates via the Merit

    Baali Hive Mother creation outside of the Swarm Embrace - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Extended play possession by a demon PC Majority vote, NPC Coordinator Notify-Coordinator: Demon

    Considered to be continued play beyond 6 months from the date the character comes to fall under one of these categories. The vote needs to be proposed before the 6th months mark, or be shelved until the vote concludes.

    Any entity possessed or inhabited by a Demon or gaining investment based powers, benefits or traits in a manner consistent with being Thrall, Diabolist, or a Demon.

    Demons are defined as entities controlled by the Demon Coordinator, such as Spirits, Earth-Bound, and Fallen.

    Fallen pcs possession of a non-supernatural body are exempt from this.

    Angels - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Angels are to be defined as Time of judgement based angels from heaven.

    Angellis Ater/Azaneal - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Veneficti Mages - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    D'habi Revenants - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Merits and Flaws

    Demonic Heritage: Laham - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Demonic Tutor - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Demonic Patron - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Unbound Diabolist - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Blessed - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Baali Apostate - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Unholy Aura - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Covenant of the old ways - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Blasphemous Pact - PC: Disallowed as a merit - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Powers< >Daimonion Based Combination Disciplines possessed by Non-Baali - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernal Combination Disciplines possessed by Non-Infernalists - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Usage of Investment: Relentless - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Investments of Rarity 2 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Investments - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernal Investments of Rarity 3

    Investments not defined in the document OWbN Infernalism: Guide to the Infernal

    Out-of-Parent-Genre powers as Infernal Investments for PCs - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Council Vote - Coordinator: Demon

    Non Baali/Angellis/Baali Apostates with Daimonion - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernalism< >Infernal Cults including Advantages or Disadvantages - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Demonic Interaction - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Only for instances that result in the establishment of a Pact or the performance of a Service (either one-time or recurring) for a PC

    Diabolism - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernal Ranking - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Removing, Escaping or Undoing Infernal Pacts - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    This includes any method by which a character is able to break free of his or her Pacts.

    Dark Thaumaturgy approval for Associates faction characters - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Sabbat

    Backgrounds

    Wells of Sacrifice lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Wells of Sacrifice lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Nest Membership lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Nest Membership lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Altar lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Altar lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Diabolist Circles lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Diabolist Circles lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Other Listings< >Demon: the Fallen Backgrounds for Non-Demons - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Disallowed - Coordinator: Demon

    Includes but is not limited to Eminence, Followers, Legacy, Pacts, Paragon, Rites, Thralls

    Membership in select Baali cults is restricted to Coordinator approval.

    Cult of Kupalla - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon, Tzimisce

    Order of the Wyrm - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon, Tremere

    Non Baali/Baali Apostates on Path of Hive (Clan book Baali, Chaining the Beast, Tal Mahe Ra Guide to the Black Hand versions) - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

  • Other Listings< >Vampires of 6th Generation or better - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Appropriate Clan Coordinator. In cases of a Clanless character, Sect Coordinator.

    This only includes non-canonical / named NPCs. All canonical / named NPCs are controlled as per the Published Canon Characters section.

    Sect Defector - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Appropriate Sects Genre Coordinator and Clan Coordinator

    Any Vampire Character that has changed its Sect allegiance, be it in background story or after entering play, is considered a Sect Defector.

    Any Character that changes their Sect allegiance from another Sect, such as the Camarilla or the Sabbat, to the Anarch Movement, after entering play, shall be given the Flaw ‘New Kid on the Block’ for a time period of no less than one year.

    Non-Kuei-Jin vampire becoming Human - PC: Majority Vote - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Varies

    1. Vampire Characters may become human or ghoul temporarily for up to 1 month without being restricted by this bylaw. Characters may not be embraced or change to any other supernatural creature other than Ghoul during this time.
    2. Vampire Characters turned mortal via the Infernal Investment "Rejuvenation" are exempt and follow the guidelines of said Investment."

to 

 
  1. Blood Magic, including both Paths and Rituals, requires the previous approval of the appropriate Coordinator for the Blood Magic in accordance with Coordinator Bylaws (Section 3.C.ii.6.a)
  2. Disciplines, Combination Disciplines, and Discipline Techniques require Notification to the Coordinator responsible for the Clan/Discipline of the character creating the custom content unless otherwise specified below:
    1. Combination Disciplines and/or Techniques which require a component of either Blood Magic or a clan-specific Discipline also requires Notification to the Coordinator responsible for the Blood Magic paradigm or clan-specific Discipline.
    2. Caitiff and Panders are overseen by the appropriate Sect Coordinator
    3. Custom Combination Discipline or Technique using Protean, Abombwe, Spiritus, and/or Ogham requires Gangrel Coordinator Approval
    4. Custom Combination Discipline or Technique using Chimerstry requires Ravnos Coordinator Approval
    5. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique or other custom content using Temporis requires Brujah Coordinator Approval
    6. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique or other custom content using Dementation requires Malkavian Coordinator Approval for Non-Malkavians
    7. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique, or other custom content using Flight and/or Visceratika requires Tremere Coordinator Approval
    8. Custom Combination Discipline, Technique or other custom content using Quietus requires Assamite Coordinator Approval
    9. Custom Combination Disciplines, Technique or other custom content using Daimonion requires Demon Coordinator Approval. 
xi:  Custom Demon the Fallen Lores, and Fallen Rituals or other custom content using Lores. PC: Coordinator Approval, NPC: Coordinator Approval.  Coordinator Demon. 
  1. DEMON CONTROLLED ITEMS< >Abilities and Lores< >Baali Lore each level - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Baali lore 1-3 For Baali, Baali Apostates, and Angellis blood line - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Baali lore 1-2 Tzimisce Clan advantage in Laws of the Night, Jocastians, Loyalist Assamites, Occult Underground lore masters, Sabbat Inquisition, Josians, and Clan Nosferatu lore masters - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Fallen Lore 1-5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Demon the Fallen with Fallen Lore 4+ PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval  - Coordinator Demon

    Demonology level 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Demonology level 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernal Lore level 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernal Lore level 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Plague Breeding level 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Plague Breeding level 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

  2. Fallen possession of a standard mortal or thrall are exempt from this bylaw unless the mortal vessel falls into one of the following categories

  3. Extended Play supernatural Possession By a Fallen. PC: Disallowed. NPC: Coordinator Approval. Coordinator Demon

  4. Supernatural genres are defined as; Vampire, Changing Breeds, Mage, Kuei-jin, Mummy, Demon, Fae, Spirit, Revenant.
  5. Extended play possession of a Supernatural by a Demon PC: Disallowed, NPC:  Coordinator Notify-Coordinator: Demon

  6. Extended play possession of semi-supernatural characters PC Coordinator approval, NPC Coordinator Notify-Coordinator: Coordinator Demon and Genre Coordinator.

  7. Kinfolk: Coordinator Demon and Changing Breeds
  8. Kinain Coordinator Demon and Changeling
  9. Hedge Mage, Imbued, Numina Demon and Hunter
  10. Ghoul Character: Demon
  11. Extended play possession is guided by the following outlines, with demons are defined as entities controlled by the Demon Coordinator, such as Demonic Spirits, Earth-Bound, and Fallen.



  1. Considered to be continued play beyond 3 months from the date the character comes to fall under one of these categories. The vote needs to be proposed before the 3rd month's mark, or be shelved until the vote concludes.

  2. Any entity possessed or inhabited by a Demon or gaining investment based powers, benefits or traits in a manner consistent with being Thrall, Diabolist, or a Demon.

  3. Extended play possession is restricted in the following manner that the Fallen soul replaces the host soul, were the Fallen lose access to the Following items a host may have had, Hedge magic, Spheres, Gnosis, Gifts, Fae Blood, Numen, Spirit Heritage, Ancestors, Avatar, Past life, Arts, and Realms. In the event of other types of demonic possessing a host removed items return at the end of the possession.

  1. Creature Types
    1. Demon Fallen - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon 
    2. Rank 5+ Demon - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
    3. Earthbound Demon - PC: Disallowed- NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  2. < >Angels - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Angels are to be defined as Time of judgment based angels from heaven.

    Angellis Ater/Azaneal - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

  3. Veneficti Mages - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  4. D'habi Revenants - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  5. Extended play Demonic possession
  • < >Powers< >Daimonion Based Combination Disciplines possessed by Non-Baali - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Dark Thaumaturgy Combination Disciplines possessed by Non-Infernalists - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Usage of Investment: Relentless - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon

    Investments 1-2  - PC: Coordinator Approval  - Coordinator: Demon

    Investments 3 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Investments not defined in the document OWbN Infernalism: Path of Screams and Blood 

    Out-of-Parent-Genre powers not printed as investments in any white wolf material for PCs - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Council Vote - Coordinator: Demon

    Custom powers as Investments PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon 

    Non Baali/Angellis/Baali Apostates with Daimonion - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Infernalism< >Demonic Interaction for Pacts: Thralls- PC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    Demonic Interaction for Deals: Diabolists - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator Demon 

    Removing, Escaping, Redeeming, or Undoing Infernal Pacts/infernal nature.- PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon

    This includes any method by which a character is able to break free of his or her Pacts or escape their infernal nature. 

     

Dark Thaumaturgy approval for Associates faction characters - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Sabbat

Dark Thaumaturgy approval for Tremere - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator Tremere 

Characters making pacts with Yama Kings: PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Kuie-jin 

Backgrounds

  1. Wells of Sacrifice lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon
  2. Wells of Sacrifice lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  3. Nest Membership lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon
  4. Nest Membership lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  5. Altar lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon
  6. Altar lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  7. Diabolist Circles lvl 4 - PC: Coordinator Notify - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Demon
  8. Diabolist Circles lvl 5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  9. Infernal Ranking - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  10. Infernal Relic 4-5 - PC: Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon 
  11. Fallen Rank 3+ PC Coordinator Approval - NPC: Coordinator Approval - Coordinator: Demon
  12. Demon: the Fallen Backgrounds for Non-Demons - PC: Disallowed - NPC: Disallowed - Coordinator: Demon   
  13. Includes but is not limited to Eminence, Followers, Legacy, Pacts, Paragon, Rites, Thralls
  • Glass Ceiling
  • Vampire are restricted by the following:
    1. Any PC who drops below 8th generation must be retired to NPC.
    2. The highest attainable level of any discipline for a player character shall be advanced.
  • Changing Breed PCs are restricted by the following:
    1. Any PC who reaches the 6th rank (the Legend equivalent) must be retired to NPC.
    2. The highest attainable level of any gift or rite for a player character shall be advanced.
  • Kuei-jin PCs are restricted by the following:
    1. Any PC who attains a Sixth rank of Dharma must be retired to NPC status
    2. The highest attainable level of any discipline or rite for a player character shall be advanced.
  • Demon Genre PCs are restricted by the following:
  •     Any PC that changes creature type to a Demon becomes an NPC
  • PC may not gain Legend gifts, Elder+ powers/rituals, level 6 Spheres, as investments. 

x. Other listings

  1. Non-Kuei-Jin characters becoming Human - PC: Majority Vote - NPC: Coordinator Notify - Coordinator: Varies
    1. Vampire Characters may become human or ghoul temporarily for up to 1 month without being restricted by this bylaw. Characters may not be embraced or change to any other supernatural creature other than Ghoul during this time.
    2. Characters turned mortal via the Infernal Investment "Rejuvenation" are exempt and follow the guidelines of said Investment."

 

File / Document: No file attachments for this vote.
Ballot Options
For
Against
Abstain